Elliott’s Adventures in Confusionland, or: On Giving Up

I’ve always had my problems. And who doesn’t? It’s part of human nature. We’re a flawed species, incapable of perfection, sometimes even incapable of just getting it right. The common wisdom given us when we realize this is simply to keep on going. “You can do it!” “Put your mind to it!” “Don’t give up!” But it’s never that easy.

Nothing is ever that easy.

My trademark flaw is simple. I have a problem with momentum. I’ve never been outrightly pessimistic, but most of the time I just don’t know how to move forward. No matter what the cost, no matter what the outcome, I find myself getting left behind. If I had to put a name to my flaw, it would be Procrastination. Sometimes I get off to a good start, then when I reach the mid-way point I stumble, and by the end of the race I find that I’ve just given up. And more often than not, I don’t care. I’ll try better next time.

And then I don’t.

It took me a while to write this post. After the discoveries of last night, I couldn’t think of anything of substance to say. It was the end. I’d tried, and I’d failed. My brother was dead. Going forward was pointless, because there was no “forward.” The race ended when my brother was killed. So I’d simply pack up and go home, give up my fight, and call it a night. What else was there to do?

But then it hit me. Ye Olde Procrastination was at it again. I had reached a steep hill, and climbing it just felt like too much work. I wasn’t in despair, I had no real answers, and nothing was final. But going forward just felt too hard. I wasn’t writing off “progress” entirely, but I was putting it on hold. And if I’ve learned anything about myself, that’s basically the same thing.

But unlike the other times, there’s too much at stake here. This isn’t a school project, this isn’t a fling, and this isn’t my half-painted kitchen. I can’t put in a fraction of an effort here, because the outcome is quite possibly certain death. I can’t “try again later,” because the cost may be my brother’s life. There’s no time to put it on hold, and there are no do-overs. This is the real deal, and my flaw has no place here.

But that doesn’t make it any easier. I am, in a word, stumped. I may have killed Procrastination for the time being, but Hades and Persephone aren’t wasting any time moving on in and taking its place. Even with one obstacle out of the way, two others pop right up. That is, until they double as a pair of white rabbits, leading me down a rabbit hole to a land made up less of Wonder, but more of complete and utter Confusion.

I have been aware of this Aidoneus fellow for a short time now. When I saw that he had hacked Epithet Alpha‘s Twitter account (which I’m just going to assume plays a part in Mr. Hobbes’ “new and improved” recruitment process), I thought perhaps we were on the same page. But now that I know for certain that we’re after the same thing (at least when it comes to who our enemies are), I find myself hesitant to take his advice. How do I know I can trust him?

With that said, I will at least admit that I trust him in regards to what he has to say about the 8th Spoke. In fact, I took it to heart and took a nice long drive to Ann Arbor, Michigan to see if I could dig anything up on them. Not surprisingly, however, I came back empty-handed. In fact, when I contacted the organizers of the Mind=Matter seminar at the University, they said they were merely a little-known co-sponsor of the event, and that the bulk of the credit went to the Hanso Foundation.

Knowing the history of Hanso, this left me feeling uneasy. Everyone and their mother is aware of the nasty things that went down in ’06, right around the time my brother disappeared, when their former CEO went nutso and their North American headquarters went kablooey. But they’ve gone through a period of rebuilding and restructuring in recent years, and have been relatively transparent in the process, leading me to believe they’re not the shady genocidal maniacs they once were.

However, that’s not to say the skeletons in their collective closet are not related to the situation at hand. Indeed, the PR person I spoke to at the Foundation told me that they severed ties with the 8th Spoke after Thomas Werner Mittlewerk went off to play Fugitive. Whether this means they’re connected to his reign of terror I cannot be sure, but it definitely left a bad taste in my mouth.

So being unable to even prove the existence of this little group, I decided to turn to the names. I was able to track down most of the people mentioned on the pamphlet, but none of them turned up any leads. In fact, a few of them didn’t even remember the seminar. The ones that did said they were simply invited by a Prof. Alexander Berne of UoM, but after checking back with individuals from the University, it appears he passed away in 2007. Suspicious, no doubt, when you consider someone by the name of Alexander was apparently hosting the 8th Spoke’s little Memorial Day get-together this very same day.

Most of the other names on the website didn’t help much either. “Dr. Hall” and “Prof. Epstein” aren’t much help, the book club folks either aren’t really citizens of Michigan or just don’t exist, and the only Dr. Lexi Greenville I could find was a dentist who thought I was crazy. A Prof. Albert Fleming did hold a lecture at Arbor Hall, but apparently said lecture had nothing to do with the 8th Spoke, so I’m just going to assume they attended it. And neither of the speakers at the group’s “remembrance” ceremony were professors at the University, so even if they exist, they’re from out of town.

That ceremony was suspicious, however. If the University wasn’t aware of this group, how could they have held an event there just a few months ago? So I contacted them again, and brought this up. But again, their story held: a group did rent out Hill Auditorium at 4:00PM on December 19th, but they weren’t the 8th Spoke. No, they were a group calling themselves The Law, and apparently they’ve been renting it out that day every year since 1993. I asked for more information, but they didn’t give it to me. Confidentiality and all that.

And so I hit a roadblock. Either this group is a sham, or they don’t want their existence to be known. And if what Aidoneus says is true, that’s probably the case: if they’re dangerous, they probably also have something to hide. But what is it? Who are they seeking revenge against? And what does this have to do with my family?

These very questions are what caused me to stumble. This feels like it’s too much to handle, and yet I have to keep going. I’m not ready to give up, especially if there’s a chance my brother is still alive. So I’m going to trust Aidoneus, at least for now. If the “revenge” the 8th Spoke is seeking is for some reason against my brother, and if my acting quickly can prevent that, then I’ll do what I can. But what exactly can I do at this point?

Attempting to contact Aidoneus on Twitter has yet to bring back any response. So for now I’m going to wait, and let him, or perhaps you, figure out what to do next. That’s all I can do for now, but at least it’s something.

Procrastination is dead. Long live Procrastination.

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276 Responses to “Elliott’s Adventures in Confusionland, or: On Giving Up”

  1. bloggymama Says:

    We’re not giving up Elliott – we’ll find a new lead for you I promise.

    Interesting fact – The Sanskrit word ‘Dharma’ is often translated by the English word ‘Law’ as in the order and law of the universe…

    Hmmm – off to ponder…

    • bloggymama Says:

      Just noticed that The 8th Spoke has a new news item –

      Bi-Monthly Book Club
      Saturday, May 23, 2009 @ 5:27 PM
      Announcing the next Bi-Monthly Book Club pick, chosen by Robert Jacobson! Julian Barbour’s “The End of Time: The Next Revolution in Physics.”

  2. bloggymama Says:

    Is it just me here today?!

    The top ‘bild’ blank picture on the home page is now a link!!

    http://www.the8thspoke.co.cc/existence.htm

    Just blank though…

    • richrag Says:

      It’s not entirely blank. It contains 14 tags which should not be needed to show an empty page. I tried variants of the url like br14.htm, 14b4.htm and brbr…br.htm (14 times) to no avail.

  3. Steff Says:

    also,
    below that picture, there is another blank image called beta.jpg (http://www.the8thspoke.co.cc/Img/beta.jpg)
    i also tried http://www.the8thspoke.co.cc/Img/alpha.jpg
    it is another blank image :S

    can anyone with skills in photoshop please try and see if there is anything ‘hidden’ in these pictures?

  4. jardeth56 Says:

    just looking at Julian Barbour’s “The End of Time: The Next Revolution in Physics.” on amazon and the book was Publishered by Phoenix

  5. raymond ludd Says:

    Don’t give up, Elliott! We’ll try to figure something out. There must be something we can do to find your brother. I’m sure that, if he was so important to them, they couldn’t just get rid of him without thinking twice. Maybe we still got time. In any case, we have to find out what to do.

    (simone ::: arp)

  6. bloggymama Says:

    Been thinking about that 5.27pm time and wondering what it could mean and then noticed that a lot of the events on the news page are weird times:

    The Memorial Day BBQ is listed as 1.30pm but then as 4pm in the description and then we have

    4.23 pm
    6.41 pm
    2.22 pm
    11.04 pm
    5.31pm
    11.15pm – but again 4pm in the description
    6.10pm
    2.42pm

    This MUST be siginificant but I have no idea why.

    • bloggymama Says:

      should be 6.19 not 6.10 sorry.

      I guess this could just be the times the items were posted on the page but they seem to refer to the events themselves?

      • bloggymama Says:

        Oh just ignore me – it IS the posting times and not the event times.

        Getting all excited over nothing!!

  7. Never Gonna Give You Up « The UNOFFICIAL LostARG: Are you a Candidate? Says:

    [...] Gonna Give You Up Elliott posted a new blog entry this morning in the aftermath of recent revelations and after trying to pursue various members of [...]

  8. vidokou Says:

    I am confused.
    The 8th Spoke/The Law rented the auditorium for 4:00pm on December 19, but the news update for the event (our remembrance day) has a post time of “December 19, 2008 @ 11:15 PM”.

  9. theotherbilly Says:

    let me see if I can clear this up.

    If you look the post that says, “Memorial Day Barbeque
    Monday, May 18, 2009″ you will notice that May 18th isn’t even close to Memorial Day. This entry was made “@ 1:30 PM”. The dates listed have nothing to do with the actual dates of the events. The dates of the events aren’t listed at all, the events are merely being announced.

    I found something odd. I doubt it means anything, but that book, “The End of Time: The Next Revolution in Physics” caught my eye. “The end of time” is also Armageddon, some call it Apocalypse.
    Anyway, I tried to put apocalypse into the URL of the 8thspoke site and I got redirected to

    • theotherbilly Says:

      *oops*
      I have an invisible cat that sometimes walks on the keyboard. He decided to hit the submit button a little premature.

      Anyway, as I was saying. I got redirected to the Awardspace hosting thing. Nothing unusual about that, but when I tried to put in the word armageddon I IE went straight to a 404 error. No page redirect or nothing.

      I’m proabably doesn’t mean anything, but I thought I should share.

      • Erik Assmus Says:

        Well if you wanted people to know you were having a memorial day party, you wouldn’t post it ON memorial day, you would post it sometime before memorial day, or else no one would come! I would think that would be obvious. Some of you are over thinking this a bit in my opinion.

      • bloggymama Says:

        No I agree – I was just being dense and over-zealous!!

        I do find the latest news event odd though – obviously the ’27’ jumped out at me and if this was the post date/time (and I’m assuming EST) then it hasn’t even happened yet! (i.e. it was ‘live’ in the early hours of this morning loooong before 5.27pm) Posting an item at a future time just screams ‘clue’ especially as it’s todays date – going to check the Existence Page at this time just in case!! It’ll probably turn out to be nothing… :D

      • bloggymama Says:

        Except today is Sunday *OBVIOUSLY* My god what is wrong with me today???!!

        No more posts from me today! I promise!!

      • Erik Assmus Says:

        Haha i know i was about to say, “you know today is the 24th right?” Maybe the 27 has something to do with it, but that is a big maybe. I think there is something we are missing though. Don’t worry, someone will find it.

  10. env420 Says:

    Probably old news, but I didn’t see it mentioned here, so what the heck. Ben killed the Dharma members on the island on December 19, 1992; one year before ‘The Law’ started renting the hall for their Remembrance Day ceremonies. I think this makes it pretty clear that 8th Spoke is Dharma, which makes sense since Dharma=Law. (Thanks bloggymama.) Now that I’m writing this, I remember seeing someone mention the purge somewhere. Anywho, this has to play a part in the revenge they are looking for. But why the Graves family? What did your family have to do with the purge of 1992 that killed 40+ Dharma folks? Have you had any luck with clues at your brother’s place? Aidoneus says your brother’s papers hold many clues, just not answers.

    And I agree with being skeptical of Aidoneus. What if Aidoneus is an 8th Spoke/Dharma member that’s just trying to lure you in so you can be taken too? Your 27th birthday is nearing. Just be careful Elliott.

    • Erik Assmus Says:

      VERY nice observation, this could be extremely important. Good research guys! I wish i was as good at hunting for clues as you guys are.

    • FlyingEngine Says:

      Given all this information my guess would be that Simeon Hobbes is a recruiter outside the island, making lists for jacob/the others. Maybe Graves family are “good people” or have some kind of inherited habilities (like Walt) that make them a good recruit. winter.htm -> it’s clear his family has history…

      So the 8th Spoke knew about Simeon, and since 1992 (as env420 says, when Ben killed the Dharma Initiative) has been trying to kill the others and the recruitments (i.e. Nathaniel Graves). winter.htm -> how else are we supposed to find them?

      Or maybe the 8th Spoke is Simeon (winter.htm -> I don’t know how long can I keep this charade, Aidoneus -> nothing is what it seems), willing to use the Graves “power” somehow.

  11. sdishman Says:

    There are a lot of “Bi-Monthly Book Club” mentions on the 8th spoke news page… I’m wondering if, in conjunction, they reveal some sort of clue. Is there something about the books, authors, and/or suggestors that could be significant? I am looking…

    • sdishman Says:

      In this vein: this may be nothing, but the publisher of the latest bi-monthly book entry (“The End of Time: The Next Revolution in Physics”) is “Phoenix”. Hmm…

  12. serm Says:

    New stuff on the8thspoke.co.cc/existence

  13. oikon7 Says:

    New clues!

    http://www.the8thspoke.co.cc/existence.htm

  14. oikon7 Says:

    The pieces of text behind the egyptian symbolds refer to Iliad, i.e. the Trojan War.

    The letters A,T,I,H,C,T,S,T,H,A,T,E are marked by red color.

    • bloggymama Says:

      Sounds like an anagram… any one any good at them?

      By the way, using Nathan’s key from the previous letter, the hiroglyphs spell out ‘wasting’ – in case that wasn’t obvious and someone was wondering :-)

      P.S. I lied about not posting again…

  15. lostfan1 Says:

    no its not an anagram cause i used an anagram solver and it only gave me nonsense

  16. oikon7 Says:

    Some comments on the names of the links:

    – neptune.html: Poseidon, the god of the sea, was initially on the side of the Trojans; he converted later by the intervention of Hera (Juno).

    – achilles.html: Achilles was one of the leaders of the Danae-Achaens-Greeks against the Trojans; he was the one that killed Hector, the Trojan leader. He was later killed by the brother of Hector, Paris.

    – juno.html: Hera, the wife of Zeus. She was on the side of the Greeks, jealous of her husband Zeus that sympathized the Trojans. She seduced Zeus to distract him, while Neptune (Poseidon) aided the Greeks.

    – hector.html: Hector, the leading warrior of the Trojans killed Patroclos, the friend of Achilles. The latter revenged his friend’s death by slaining Hector – a central topic of the epic poem “Iliad” by Omerus.

    – agamemnon.html: Agamemnon, the king of Mycenae and leader of the Greeks in the Trojan War. Although on the same sime, he was not in good terms with Achilleus. Agamemnon was the brother of Menelaos, the king of Sparta: the abduction of Helena, the wife of Menelaos, by Paris, the prince of Troja, was presented as the reason of the Greek expedition against the Trojans.

    – ulysses.html: Odysseus, the Greek kind of Ithaka, an important figure of the “Iliad”. He was the one that proposed to his comrades to construct the Trojan Horse (Doureios Hippos) and offer it to the Trojans as a sign of congregation to supposedly mark the end of the War and the retreat of the Greeks. The Horse was a trick: once the Trojans accepted the gift, the Greeks entered Troja and conquered the city. The topic of the subsequent book of Omerus referred to the return trip of Odysseus from Troja back to his home island, Ithaka.

    – tydeus.html: actually the link refers to the *son* of Tydeus, the warlord Diomedes. He accompanied Odysseus (Ulysses) to a mission to the Trojan camp, to spy the intention of their foes.

    Just one more point: there existed a character named “Pho(e)nix” in the Iliad: he was a consultant of Achilleus, the one that convinced him to return to the battle after a heavy disagreement between Achilleus and Agamemnon.

  17. lostfan1 Says:

    flying engine i used an anagram solver i found on google. i cant remember the name but its the first link that you see

    • FlyingEngine Says:

      thanks

      by the way, are u all guys in twitter? If we have to struggle, we can struggle better together… xD

  18. sdishman Says:

    It may only appear as nonsense in the anagram solver because there may be names buried in it. For example, the letters “I. Theta” are definitely in there…

  19. benvyle Says:

    Does anyone else think the heiroglyphs tjhemselves may spell the next clue/link?

    I tried working it out but all I came up with (with the help of a dodgy heiroglyphic alphabet) was: S_TA_ _ _

    any ideas?!?!?

  20. DrB Says:

    Is there any significance in there being small dots below some of the letters in the linked extracts (THICTIST) or am I just reading too much into it?

    • env420 Says:

      I noticed that too. I also noticed that some of the letters are gray; OVETANGLETLMHANUENDNGMEON. Now I think I’m definitely reading too much into it. I tried it in several cypher decoders, but to no avail.

  21. diggingforanswers Says:

    Pertaining to the Book Club posting at 5:27…

    What if 5:27 is pointing at a date where something significant may happen. 5/27…May 27th…3 days from today.

    May be nothing…if so, sorry!

  22. DrB Says:

    env420, I noticed that too and I’m sure it’s a coincidence but Agamemnon is in that ‘anagram’, leaving OVETNLETLHNUEDNG…

    Definitely time to stop seeing clues where there aren’t any!

    • env420 Says:

      I didn’t notice that. Hmmm…I know we seem to be grasping for straws here, but no idea is a bad idea. :)

  23. Steff Says:

    it’s not reading too much into it..
    there are 3 kinds of letters:
    red – ATIHCTSTHATE
    gray – OVETANGLETLMHANUENDENGMEON
    dot – THICTNEIST

    i tried several cipher decrypting tools.. but i dont have much experience with those :S

    • Ryan Says:

      I tried using an anagram site, wordsmith.org, but I don’t think any of the anagrams that came up for any of those 3 are anything important, so I also think it’s some sort of coded message… although I did get a couple of greek letters like Chi and Theta in the anagrams.

    • sdishman Says:

      Can someone point out a specific example of these “dotted” letters? I may be dense but I’m not seeing them…

      Plus we may need to verify the gray letters, there are two posts so far containing those letters (DrB and Steff), and there is disagreement between the contents. Messing something like that up could throw everything off.

      • sdishman Says:

        OK, I found one finally… On “hector.htm”, second word, there is a barely-noticeable dot under the “I”.

      • Ryan Says:

        On the agamemnon page, look at the red T on the bottom left, there is a dot under it.

      • sdishman Says:

        I meant to say there was disagreement over the dotted letters, not the gray ones… but I’ve gone through and double-checked, and Steff’s list looks correct. The “NE” in her list that don’t appear in DrB’s list are definitely on the tydeus page, towards the beginning…

      • Ryan Says:

        Oh, okay. BTW, I tried to make a sentence out of THICTNEIST, and I came up with this, although it probably isn’t what those letters are supposed to mean:
        HE IS IN CTTT. After seraching, I found that is one of the T’s was gone, making it CTT, and that CTT is an acronym for the national postal service of Portugal, and that in 2007 they offered moblie phone service with the brand name Phone-ix (Phoenix!) Most likely, it’s just a coincidence with the Phoenix part and all.

      • Ryan Says:

        ^oops, spelling mistakes: “is” is supposed to be “if” and seraching is searching

  24. Ryan Says:

    Also a side note about Julian Barbour, author of The End of Time: The Next Revolution In Physics: he suggested that time is an illusion, and that there is no “motion” forward, there are only moments called “nows” that just happen. Also, he lives near Oxford… sound familiar?

    • Ryan Says:

      Actually, now that I checked, 3 of the 4 authors mentioned under the Bi-Monthly events have some connection to Oxford, although it probably doesn’t mean anything

  25. Ryan Says:

    2 more things:

    1. Did anyone else see who signed Alexander Berne’s certificate? It was Peter Thompson, one of the Hanso exec’s.

    2. I’m pretty sure the same font that is used for “Forever In Rememberence” on the 8th Spoke pages is the one used for the passages on the hector, neptune, ect. pages. So is the 8th Spoke trying to throw us off course?

    • env420 Says:

      You know I thought the same thing. Wasting….are we wasting our time because the 8th spoke is trying to throw us off. At least I’m not alone in these thoughts.

  26. Amanda Says:

    I stumbled upon another link in the 8th spoke website. the8thspoke.co.cc/resistance.htm. The page itself appears to be blank, but in the source code is the saying “Patience is a virtue”. I’ve tried urls with this phrase as well as patience and virtue on their own, but to no avail. Any ideas on this?

  27. Amanda Says:

    thanks =) i’ve been messing around with those letters for an hour now and coming up with nothing. actually, hah, i just googled “the8thspoke.co.cc”. There was some link for “extreme tracking” that came up, and there was a misspelled link for resistance.htm. Tried it out of curiosity, and to my surprise something actually came up.

  28. Amanda Says:

    Perhaps, I’m getting ahead of it..I assume that the second white block on the main 8th spoke page will also become a link, maybe the one I just stumbled on?

  29. lostfan1 Says:

    amanda i did the same thing today and found another link on the extreme traking page:

    the8thspoke.co.cc/proverb.htm.

    its classified as latest refferer and dated monday may 25. so expect a new page on monday

  30. Amanda Says:

    It did indeed. I think it was blank for a few days after our discovery of the website. I hope we don’t have to be patient for too long. Maybe someone will make sense of those Iliad links and we’ll have another direction to go in.

  31. lostfan1 Says:

    the resistance page is updated! it has a message saying come back when you can show your work

    the words show your work are a link to something but i havent tried it cuz i came back here to post this

  32. sdishman Says:

    You can mouseover the link to see where it goes… looks like it points to an email address: showyourwork@the8thspoke.co.cc … this could just be a red herring, or maybe after we figure something out, we need to email it to this address.

    • Ryan Says:

      Well, looks like whoever posted the message on the resistance page is monitering this blog to see if we “get too far ahead.”

  33. Ryan Says:

    “if you get ahead of yourselves, you’ll have to start over.
    don’t go forward unless you can <a style="text-decoration: none" href="mailto:showyourwork@the8thspoke.co.cc"

  34. Ryan Says:

    Elliot, should you try emailing it about all the work you’ve done?

    • sdishman Says:

      I’m willing to bet this is their way of saying, “quit trying to skip ahead – focus on the clues you currently have and solve those first”.

      • Ryan Says:

        That’s what I think, too. It also seems as though someone is monitering this page closely…

  35. Amanda Says:

    I agree. =/ It says “You shouldn’t be here” at the top of the page. Sorry, Elliott, I was only trying to help.
    And Ryan, I think you’re right on the nose..didn’t take long to put something on that page at all..

    Back to the letters, I go.

  36. Amanda Says:

    None of the links on the “wasting” page work for me now.

  37. Ryan Says:

    There’s also a new link on the wasting page, but it just goes back to the 8th Spoke news page.

  38. lostfan1 Says:

    i think maybe show your work means we need to email them this:

    http://www.the8thspoke.co.cc/existence.htm

    thats the certificate of alexander berne

  39. sdishman Says:

    New tweet from epithet alpha: “Wasting” was an adequate word, because when you skip ahead, that’s what you do with your time. Time to start over. –AIDONEUS

    • sdishman Says:

      I take this to mean that we were ahead of ourselves even on the “wasting.htm” page – which makes sense, because we got there from existence.htm, which originally was blank (probably meaning it wasn’t “ready” for us to access yet).

      And since wasting now links back to the news feed, this is a clear clue that we missed something there, and need to focus there instead…

  40. lostfan1 Says:

    sdishman, lets assume your right and theres a missing clue in all this. if the wasting page was getting ahead, then that leaves us with bernes certificate. elliot said that bernes passed away in 2007, then how come today in 2009 there honoring him with a certificate? ( im assuming all this of course since the certificate doesnt have a date)

    • sdishman Says:

      Well, it also leaves us with the news page, which wasting.htm now links us back to. That seems like a pretty big clue to me. A new bi-monthly book club note was posted to that page very recently. I really think that’s a hint that there’s something on that page (possibly related to the book club notes) that needs discovering. Also, Aidoneus’ latest tweet says “time to start over”, which means we need to back up… only thing I’m not sure is, how *far* to back up. The beginning of the 8th Spoke page? Or something even before that?

      Of course I could be totally wrong, but it’s just my thought…

      • Ryan Says:

        I believe you are right on track, we need to look for something on the News page, although lostfan1 could be on to something with the certificate.

        The thing is, really the only thing I’ve found of interest is that Bi-Monthly is also used to describe something 2 times a month, whereas on the 8th Spoke it means once every 2 months (which is also a valid meaning of Bi-Monthly)

        I’ve tried researching the most recent book, and it talks about how time doesn’t really exist, it’s an illusion

      • Ryan Says:

        I believe you are right on track, sdishman, look for something on the News page, although lostfan1 could be on to something with the certificate.

        The thing is, really the only thing I’ve found of interest is that Bi-Monthly is also used to describe something 2 times a month, whereas on the 8th Spoke it means once every 2 months (which is also a valid meaning of Bi-Monthly)

        I’ve tried researching the most recent book, and it talks about how time doesn’t really exist, it’s an illusion

      • Ryan Says:

        whoops, ignore my second comment, i tried to edit the other one and send it again, but it just sent both :)

    • diggingforanswers Says:

      Also, the Memorial Day BBQ post says that it will be held at Alexander’s house. I’m thinking there something to that too.

  41. Amanda Says:

    If this person is monitoring the blog to make sure we don’t get ahead of ourselves, why didn’t he say anything about the wasting page with the letters earlier? Unless my timecodes are wrong, we’ve been puzzling over the wasting page for 8 hours. It seems that stumbling upon the resistance page evoked this response. It seems unclear exactly how far we need to backtrack..

  42. carbo Says:

    i got the feeling that finding the resistance page was what caused this. i have a feeling the glyphs/iliad puzzle was probably going to lead there, which is probably why that section is now down.

  43. diggingforanswers Says:

    There is an update to the existence.htm site…there is now an overlay of text talking about 2 missing years…haven’t looked at it much, just noticed it is there.

    • diggingforanswers Says:

      I think this update is helping us get back to the ‘start over’ point. Maybe this is where we missed something.

  44. Tyler Says:

    um…. might be late on this and haven’t noticed it, but something’s up with the existence.htm page

    look for yourselves: http://www.the8thspoke.co.cc/existence.htm

  45. Gary Says:

    OK, so he’s still alive, and there’s a party at his house Monday at 4 PM. Does that mean we have to wait until then for the next clue?

  46. diggingforanswers Says:

    Finally…more clues. The existence.htm now leads to a new set of heiroglyphs at waste.htm.

  47. Spireofdublin Says:

    Seems to be a new list of different coloured letters. I found genome in the first hyroglyph using all the grey letters. The red letters don’tmake sense

  48. Gary Says:

    I spoke too soon . . . but is this also a WASTE of time?

    Red letters at wasting.htm links: ATIHCTSTHATE
    Dotted letters at wasting.htm links: THICTNEIST
    Gray letters at wasting.htm links: OVETANGLETLMHANUENDENGMEON

    Red letters at waste.htm links: TTFNB8HASOO
    Dotted letters at waste.htm links: KMUOBRHSOO
    Gray letters at waste.htm links: GMEONEMHNAUUEVINEERSGLATNEIDMENFTO

    • Gary Says:

      Correction:

      Dotted letters at waste.htm links: KMUOBRHSOOM

      (I originally left out the last M)

      g

      • Gary Says:

        Correction 2:

        Dotted letters at waste.htm links: KMUONBRHSOOM

        (I also originally left out an N. Sorry! Shoot me now!)

        It anagrams out to Mushroom knob.

        g

    • sdishman Says:

      You have the number 8 listed in the waste.htm red letters – certainly this is a typo, right? The list should be: TTFNBHASOO

  49. Gary Says:

    Good call Spire — the four book club books are referenced in the gray letters in the four pages of text linked from waste.htm.

  50. Gary Says:

    GENOME HUMAN ELEGANTUNIVERSE ENDOFTIME

  51. Spireofdublin Says:

    Ah very good. I couldn’t make sense of the other anagrams but i knew genome was from the book club

  52. Amanda Says:

    Great work! Maybe you should e-mail that link, it could be the work that needs to be shown..

  53. EmPuLSe Says:

    So I was really hung up on the waste.htm page. . .

    W – eumelus.htm, a – heavenwards.htm, S – index.htm (?), t – achilles.htm, e – agamemnon. htm. Why does the S goto 8th spoke?

    After reviewing the page source we have found that the S which takes us back to the index has some alt text next to it. “Img/C.jpg” alt=”byblos”

    Not having a clue what “byblos” was, I fed it into google, and I’ll be damned. It is a Greek name for a Phoenician city. http://bit.ly/13hPU1

    Interesting tie to our other Greek stuff. What it means, I dont know. . . But it certainly means something.

  54. Gary Says:

    My gut is he’s telling us to find a clue in an anagram on the 8th spoke news page. The names of the individuals who proposed the book club books are suspicious, but I can’t make anything out of them.

  55. Gary Says:

    Note correction above — I left out two dotted letters linked from waste.htm. Not that it helps me any!

  56. Jay Says:

    Yeah, I figured out the book anagrams on my own, got all excited…and realized it didn’t help me with anything. :(

  57. serm Says:

    Perhaps this is just another Ghost Town in the Land of Confusion:-)

    After going crazy about this whole “letter-salad” from the existence-page, I started to read some of the earlier comments and stopped at “being skeptical of Aidoneus”:

    Has anyone noticed the SIGNATURE of “Aidoneus”? There are two hyphens at the start –> “–AIDONEUS”

    There is also (in my eyes) a little space between the “A” and the “I”
    –> “–A IDONEUS”

    IDONEUS is the latin word for “DESERVING, CAPABLE” (google it!)

    In addition, the excerpts of the Iliad (behind the hieroglyphs) always use the LATIN NAMES of the Greek Gods (e.g NEPTUNE instead of POSEIDON).

    ==> What if there are two letters missing in the name of “–A IDONEUS”, giving the whole story a new twist… So latin experts, it’s your turn…

  58. A Slap On The Wrist From Aidoneus « The UNOFFICIAL LostARG: Are you a Candidate? Says:

    [...] Will write up all the further news when I get the chance – in the meantime check the WISH? Blog to read what [...]

  59. raymond ludd Says:

    The four statues!!! The four statues!!!

    Sorry, but I’m still there, on the “Black Jug” file. The clue on SH website says: “The next clue is the white letters on video you will receive four lines like four statues …. only one line is used and connected with a color”.

    The Byblos excerpt from the book mentioned by EmPulse (http://bit.ly/13hPU1) mentions four statues: Hygeia, Orpheus, Achilles, Penthesilea.

    Is there any connection? Ok, my brain is melting!

    ::: arp

  60. Doc M Says:

    Whoa- dammit missed the new clues again- sucks being in the UK!

    raymond where did you get the below clue???

    : “The next clue is the white letters on video you will receive four lines like four statues …. only one line is used and connected with a color”.

    and the four statues??

  61. Doc M Says:

    is the http://simeonhobbes.webs.com/ page legit? is it part of the arg or is this a faker?? im not sure

  62. Doc M Says:

    http://simeonhobbes.webs.com/ isnt on the watching section of elliott’s blog so im ignoring it for now

  63. Spireofdublin Says:

    Byblos is also a form of hyroglyphic code. It is known as Byblos syllabary

  64. anne_wintermute Says:

    Well I’ve been playing with the letters in the two possibble anagrams and so far on the dotted ones I’ve found the words HORUS and BOOK (and some letters which make no sense lol) and on the red ones you can find the word HANSO (and again letters which don’t make sense)

    • Tyler Says:

      I might have missed a letter or two, but after taking out HORUS and BOOK from the dotted letters, I’m left with “MM”. Could this be an abbreviation for something… or maybe initials?

  65. env420 Says:

    It makes so much more sense now that I see someone found a link we weren’t supposed to find yet! ;) But do we disregard the first set of passages and letters (from wasting.htm)? I did notice that the grey letters from the wasting.htm links spelled out (nearly) the same thing the grey letter from the waste.htm links spelled, the books mentioned for the bi-monthly book clubs. Working on the red and dotted letters. I’m thinking they lead us to something on the 8th spoke page, much as the grey letters did. I could be completely off base, but worth a shot. Anyone else found anything new?

  66. env420 Says:

    Could MM be the year the book was published? It would make sense that the other letters would perhaps lead us to other books since the grey letters lead us to the books on the 8th spoke webpage. MM would be 2000? Okay, so check this out, a book titled “The Eye of Horus,” written by Carol Thurston, published in 2000 (MM.) However, it’s a fiction novel and probably unrelated. :(

  67. env420 Says:

    There’s an N in there too. So the letters left over would be M N M. Mmmmm….m&ms! Love the green ones! :)

  68. Doc M Says:

    grey letters from wasted htm very similar to waste htm

    genome, elegant, human

    but letters left over

    OVTLNDN

  69. DrB Says:

    Ditto on the UK thing and on the question to Raymond – where can I find that stuff you’re talking about??

  70. Spireofdublin Says:

    There is another image under the link to existence.htm , there is no link from this image . . . . yet. Was the second image always there? Its called beta.jpg

    • Ryan Says:

      Yes, I believe it’s been there for a while. Hopefully it will turn into some link soon…

    • Gary Says:

      Yes, even before the first (alpha) image link became active.

      • FlyingEngine Says:

        which encoding system was used for LGJ MLU KYJ on simeonhobbes.webs.com?

      • Gary Says:

        The letters were found in a file called 27277222727.avi. They were displayed in the video and read out military-style (alpha bravo charlie) in the audio. Are you asking how the avi was encoded?

      • sdishman Says:

        Guys – that site is *not* in-game… I’m sure Elliott would appreciate not cluttering this board with references to things that have no pertinence to his issue. Let’s focus on the clues in front of us…

      • FlyingEngine Says:

        Nope, I was wondering if you had already decoded that (LGJ MLU KYJ), I find specially interesting the fact the letters come in triplets… (the dottted letters on waste.htm also come in triplets)

      • Gary Says:

        No luck, sorry.

  71. serm Says:

    Jope, since yesterday… Hope some deus ex machina will appear linking to new clues…

  72. Ryan Says:

    Also, has anyone sent an email to showyourwork@the8thspoke.co.cc?

  73. Ryan Says:

    Okay, I don’t know if this has been posted before, but here it is: Aidoneus is lengthened form of Aïdês, which is another name for Hades!
    And since in the myth Hades took Persephone, does this Aidoneus have something to do with why Nathan is missing?

  74. Gary Says:

    Anybody heading over to Alexander’s house for the party at 4 today?

  75. Doc M Says:

    I think the Byblos reference hidden in the waste.htm source code for hierglyph 3 (the one that leads back to the 8th spoke page with the book club info) is just there to point out that the book titles mentioned in the iliad text (grey letters) are important given that,

    The name Byblos originated from € ’±biblion€ ’², which means € ’±book€

    I dont think its trying to point out a link between the iliad and Byblos… but then again I could be wrong..

    • sdishman Says:

      I agree with the Doc… I think Aidoneus is beating us over the head with references to the book club… I just haven’t been able to find anything yet. I’ve been looking on the Amazon page for each book, seeing if they have anything in common, but haven’t found anything yet.

      Perhaps it’s nothing about the books themselves, but some puzzle with either their names, or (more likely) the people who suggested the book, since those are “fake” names possibly chosen for a reason…

  76. bloggymama Says:

    This may be nothing but I was just writing up the blog and including some links to all the books mentioned on Amazon.com just in case their content might give us some clues.

    Every book mentioned has a ‘search inside’ facility on Amazon allowing us to look at the first few pages – do you think there might be some clues IN the books themselves???

    Links on the blog to save you some time: http://www.lostarg.wordpress.com

  77. Daniel0605 Says:

    So do you guys think any update is going to happen in a few minutes?

    • bloggymama Says:

      Well the BBQ is just starting now! Maybe when it’s finished?? Maybe we’ll get some photos or something :-D

  78. bloggymama Says:

    When you type the keywords decoded from the grey letters GENOME, HUMAN, ELEGANT UNIVERSE, and END OF TIME into Amazon.com – the corresponding books all appear at number 1 in the search results…

    Just found this curious. Maybe we need to find a new ‘keyword’ from the codes, enter it into Amazon, and the number one search result will give us our title??

  79. Ryan Says:

    Ha, when i looked at the Amazon site for the books, all of the articles say “Want it delivered Wednesday, May 27?” 27!

    Other than that, I see no connection between them besides the themes

  80. Ryan Says:

    Also, the julian Barbour book was reviewed by someone from Library Journal, and he was “formerly with Univ. of Michigan Lib., ANN ARBOR”
    (the caps weren’t actually there, I added them for emphasis)

    • bloggymama Says:

      Well that CAN’T be a co-incidence surely!!

      • bloggymama Says:

        haha I think we’re starting to see clues everywhere now – I was looking at the customer reviews and say the review title “a WASTE of time” and got all excited!

        I think we can officially say that we are stuck. And desperate!

      • Ryan Says:

        I was thinking the same while writing my earlier comment, that maybe there are no more clues for now and we’re just looking for things that aren’t there (or finding things that aren’t supposed to be :) )

        But then again, the title of the waste page is “there’s a light in the darkness”…

  81. Ryan Says:

    I was just reading the “About” page on the 8th Spoke site, and it says “…and continue to share our thoughts at weekly meetings…” Where would these weekly meetings be held? Arbor Hall?

  82. DharmaAndWreck Says:

    Speaking of the book club: The bimonthly picks have all been announced on the 23rd (Nov, Jan, May), so the next will be on July 23rd – which from what I remember is Elliott’s birthday, the day he turns 27? And the Thomas Levi letter was dated July 22nd…just a thought.

  83. Jay Says:

    Yeah, I noticed the 23, but couldn’t get anything out of it. I tried february since that was in the middle of the middle book club dates but…gah!

  84. Jay Says:

    I also think we need one more piece of information to progress forward from where we are. There IS a light in the darkness, we just don’t have it…yet.

  85. Daniel0605 Says:

    Yeah I really have no idea where to start. I was going to look at the waste.htm page and try to discover more of that, maybe try and decode more of the letters but I think we should listen to Aidoneus’s warning:

    “”Wasting” was an adequate word, because when you skip ahead, that’s what you do with your time. Time to start over. –AIDONEUS”

    What does it mean by starting over though? Maybe we missed a very important clue in the beginning?

    • Spireofdublin Says:

      Could it mean back to twitter? Are any of those made up book club names on it somewhere? There is a john kozak . . .

  86. Marygold Says:

    does anyone think the book club things mentioned and the link to the main page might mean that the ‘key’ to this puzzle is in the book club post themsselves??? like maybe the red letters and dots corespond to words or letters in the book club posts or maybe even the books themsselves. i dontk now just thinking out loud

  87. Ryan Says:

    Elliot, if you’re there, can you post amy new information that you might have, or even your thoughts on anything recent?

  88. diggingforanswers Says:

    This might be a little far-fetched, but does the name Thomas Burns jump out at anybody. I was messing around with the red and dotted letters. If you combine the two, it can be turned into “BOOK OF MONTH THOMAS BURNS.” It’s probably nothing…just trying to find something.

  89. Spireofdublin Says:

    Thats pretty good. I was doing the same thing , i had “book of” and was trying to find something out of the rest of the letters. What you have makes sense

  90. DharmaAndWreck Says:

    This stuff has been building momentum in my mind all night, hope it fits here…will post on http://lostarg.wordpress.com/ too.

    Okay, here’s a halfbaked theory which I hope will partially explain the sequence of the last WASTE hieroglyphs, their ties to the Illiad excerpts, and the zombie BBQ host!
    A series of clues on Twitter (no idea if they’re Wanon or not) lead us to French egyptologist J.F. Champollion, and from him to Sir Alan Gardiner, who created an extensive, categorized list of hieroglyphs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gardiner%27s_Sign_List). Each glyph has a Gardiner Code, and they are organized according to theme, such as “Mammals” or “Ships and parts of ships”. Apart from their literal meaning, some of them seem to have an extra layer of meaning within ancient Egyptian culture as well. This got me thinking, or possibly overthinking. You guys get to be the judges of that!

    The five symbols currently spelling WASTE on http://the8thspoke.co.cc/waste.htm, their cultural meanings and the themes of the texts they lead to:

    CODE SYMBOL MEANING FILE NAME THEME
    S38 Staff Power Eumelus “Eumelus, king of men”.

    O26 Portal ——- Heavenwards A god weighing fates.

    G33 Bird ——- Achilles Achilles can’t kill Lycaon.

    X1 Loaf/cake —— Byblos (Link back to newsfeed)

    V9 Shen ring Eternity Agamemnon Diomed choosing a companion for a quest.

    Possible connections between the symbols and accompanying texts:
    The staff: Power + King = self-explanatory.

    The door: A portal, heavenwards…knockin’ on heaven’s door? “The sire of all” weighs “two fates of death” on his golden scale; Some kind of deity or fate (Zeus I think) is deciding who lives or dies amongst the Trojans and Achaeans.

    The (unnamed) bird: (Not sure why this symbol is chosen). Achilles wonders why Lycaon seems to be unkillable–even the underworld can’t hold him. Lycaon grabs his knees and spear, clinging desperately to life.

    The loaf of bread: Byblos = papyrus, book. Directs us back to the newspage with book club announcements. They must be important. No idea why it’s bread–I like books, but never tried to eat them.

    The Shen ring: As in so many other cultures, the ring stands for eternity. Another symbol placed within the ring of the Shen glyph became everlasting–if a name was used it became a cartouche (king’s seal used on tombs). Diomed’s quest sounds exiting, maybe perilous, but everyone wants to go; Agamemnon advices him to choose by merit, not royalty. Apparently you have to earn this honor.

    So if I should draw some kind of sweeping conclusion from this, it’s all about determining who is granted eternal life. Someone has the power to choose who dies (goes “heavenwards”), and who stays and lives forever. If that’s correct, I think we can conclude from the Existence-file that sent us to Waste in the first place (and has been hammered home with extra emphasis as we missed it the first time) that Alexander Berne has been chosen, and is not even slightly dead–even an excentric organization like 8th Spoke wouldn’t give someone a certificate of recognition two years posthumously, or throw a barbecue in their dead founder’s home! So, the question remains: WHO HAS THAT POWER? Who’s our Zeus?

    And why did they choose Alexander? Have the 8th Spoke found a way to extend life indefinately, or did someone else grant him this?

    BTW, the same source who pointed to Champillion also told me “The myth of Er”. This is a parable of Plato’s about a man slain in battle who is allowed to witness the judgement of souls–some going to heaven, others the underworld–before returning to life on his funeral pyre… As for possible meanings of the Gardiner codes of the symbols (S38, O26, G33, X1, V9), maybe relating to the red/grey/dotted letters, I’ll leave it for someone else to play with. Tomorrow I’ll have a go at the old WASTING glyphs and play a bit of spot-the-difference. My overheated brain needs sleep…

  91. Marygold Says:

    not sure if it means anything, but i just noticed alexanders hanso certificate looks a lot like harpers on lost
    http://www.yuzsekiz.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/hanso.jpg

    • Ryan Says:

      Yes, it does…there’s even 3 lines of text in the middle just like in Alexander’s. It also looks like 2 people signed Harper’s, but only Peter Thompson signed Alexander’s.

  92. Gary Says:

    I was working on the wasting.htm hieros and posted them to http://lostarg.wordpress.com/2009/05/24/never-gonna-give-you-up/#comments before someone pointed out the simple correspondence to the word “wasting”.

    I got:

    Gardiner Ref – sound – what it represents

    S38 – “achqA” – scepter / ruler
    O26 – “wdj” or “aachaw” – stele
    X1 – “t” – bread
    G? – “?” – not sure which bird – maybe bennu?
    M22 – “nichb” – some kind of plant
    AA28 – “qd” – unknown
    O40 – “rwd” – stairway

    And my table got messed up too! :-)

  93. Marygold Says:

    just found this??
    http://the8thspoke.co.cc/bookofmonththomasburns.htm

  94. sdishman Says:

    Marygold, I’m confused – I got an email saying you had posted a link, but I can’t find that comment anymore. Did you delete it?

    Anyways, for the benefit of others – based on the previous discussion of “book of month” and “thomas burns”, this link was found:

    http://the8thspoke.co.cc/bookofmonththomasburns.htm

    As I suspected, we *do* have all the clues we need, and the solution *is* on the news page… so let’s get crackin’!

  95. env420 Says:

    So I wasn’t wrong in thinking Alexander Berne is NOT dead! We need to find him…or some reference to him. I’ve been playing with the book titles, isbn numbers, authors, content, blah blah blah. I have been unable to find anything significant. Either I’m looking too hard or not looking hard enough. But I too have been at this for hours and hours…going through numerous nonfiction book club sites, science blogs, all kinds of useless stuff. I researched the names of the people who chose the books, but nothing there either. I’m completely stumped and need direction. HELP ELLIOTT!!!

  96. env420 Says:

    Okay, so as I announced defeat new clues were found. Figures. lol Guess I’ll be up for a few more hours. :)

  97. sdishman Says:

    OK, I see 3 things of meaning in the latest clue:

    “down is across” – I’ve thought for awhile that it was odd that all the red letters are in the first column of the texts – perhaps what’s meaningful is what *row* they’re in? We count __down__ to their row, and then use that to count __across__ somehow on the news page?

    “dots are details” – either the dotted letters themselves, or perhaps their positions in the text, further clarify how to decipher text on the news page?

    “red can be read readily, but not without counting” – this seems to suggest that the red letters can be used on their own to form a code/clue/solution of some kind… except for the “not without counting” part. Not quite sure what that means.

    Anyways, those are just my thoughts at the moment, maybe they’ll help someone else spark an idea…

    • sdishman Says:

      Also, the number of red / dotted letters are identical – perhaps this is further evidence that they should be used in conjunction to solve the puzzle…

  98. Gary Says:

    Dotted letters only appear in rows with a red letter at the start. Maybe we need to examine the relationship between the dotted letters and the red letters.

  99. DarrellEW Says:

    i thought that maybe we should take whichever row the dotted letter (and red letter) is in as the word in that particular book club post, and then take the column that the dotted letter is in as the letter of that word to choose. i ended up with NEDNGTEITATE, so i guess it was the wrong thing to do, but i think that’s the sort of thing we need to be trying.

    • Gary Says:

      Right, each page of text relates to a book, so there must be some way to combine the text pages with the book entries.

    • walter42 Says:

      did u try doing the same thing but with bi-monthly as 1 word? i got the same results as you but didn’t want to do it again when i noticed it might change if i treated bi-monthly that way

  100. Spireofdublin Says:

    Could it be something to do with how far across (how many characters) the dotted letter is from each corresponding red letter?

  101. bloggymama Says:

    I’ve been trying this:

    The row number that has the red letter in corresponds to that number word in the book announcement
    The letter number (counting across) that has the grey dot is the letter number of that word.

    For example on the ‘Genome’ page

    Red letter= row number 1
    Dot= letter number 8

    This corresponds to the word “Announcing” and the letter I

    Giving us for all four passages in total

    IKT NIT ESB AN

    BUT when I’m counting rows I’m not sure whether to count the paragraph breaks?

    If you do that you get

    IKD NIT ERG AN

    Neither combination makes any sense to me no matter how I look at it but I thought I’d include it here just so you can see what’s been tried.

    Someone cleverer than me is going to have to figure this out I think! Good luck!

  102. diggingforanswers Says:

    When you look at the source code for this new URL, it says ‘something missing’. Maybe that will help us figure this out.

  103. diggingforanswers Says:

    Correction: “something’s missing”

  104. DrB Says:

    Check out the source code:

    –The image is called rouge (red)
    –It includes the phrase “something’s missing”.

  105. serm Says:

    The numbers of the first line down are the red letters of the Iliad-texts!!!

  106. DrB Says:

    Damn, I’m stuck at work and can’t spend any time on this atm. Save some for me!!

  107. Sens Says:

    Each horizontal line in “disintegrate” corresponds to the line of Iliad marked with red letter. And each number in a row represents the beginning letter of each word in a line. For example, let’s take the first horizontal row (20 19 20 19 15 16 1 20 4 15 3), this row corresponds to the line in “eumulus” – T(20)hus s(19)poke t(20)he s(19)on o(15)f P(16)eleus a(1)nd t(20)he d(4)rivers o(15)f c(3)harriots… As you can see we have one word missing it’s the 12th word in that line – “bestirred” – beginning with letter B which is the second in the alphabet. Thus the first number in the red row of “desintegrate” is 2. The next number we have is 1 which corresponds to the word “anchises” (the 12th word in the second line on “eumelus” beginning with red letter. And so on…

    …till we reach red numbers 8, 19, 15 and the very last one 19(S).
    8 (H) has a corresponding word “sold”.
    19 (S) – “but”.
    15 (O) – the word is missing at all since the corresponding line only has 11 words in it. (“Spear passed over his back, and stuck in the ground, hungering”)
    19 (S) doesn’t have a corresponding word either, because there are only 10 lines of Iliad marked with red letters, and number 19 (S) is 11th in the row.

    Well I just have to figure out what to do with all this. O_o

  108. Sens Says:

    Thanks a lot :) And it’s not like the words are missing… Uhm it’s more like the red numbers (8 19 15) and (19) have “wrong” corresponding words (which start with different letters) or don’t have them at all. I guess i’m bad at explaining :)

    Quick example. Let’s take the red number 8. It’s the 6th number in the red row, which means we have to look for the word in the 6th line of Iliad marked with red letter. That 6th line is on http://the8thspoke.co.cc/achilles.htm and it’s – “Here? If this man can come back alive after having been sold over”. 8=H, and according to the rest of red numbers, the letters they mean and words they correspond to, the 12th word in the above mentioned line of Iliad should begin with letter H. But as we can see the 12th word in that line is “sold”, beginning with S.

    I really don’t know what this means yet. But i guess we should look for the answers in this numbers/letters (8,19,15,19/H,S,O,S), since they sort of break the rules of the rest of the “disintegrate” diagramm.

  109. Sens Says:

    And as requested by BigNorse, here’s the list with red numbers (letters they mean) – and a corresponding word from Iliad.
    2(B) – bestirred
    1(A) – anchises
    13(M) – made
    13(M) – morning
    19(S) – sun
    8(H) – Sold – “wrong” word
    19(S) – But – “wrong” word
    15(O) – (no corresponding word)
    19(S) – servants
    7(G) – go
    19(S) – (no corresponding word)

  110. raymond ludd Says:

    Sorry for the misleading informations on the Simeon Hobbes website – I’ve got stucked there, and I mixed up things, so please forgive me, I will not put it out again.

    About the matrix: if we have to translate it in letters in alphabetical order (A=1, B=2 and so on), then we should have this matrix

    T S T S O P A T D O C
    T M H B G T A B E S O
    F I O A S T N N S O N
    N S L A T D W A I W S
    B A O A A T P F B W T
    H I T M C C B A A H B
    A T A H W H S M T K H
    S P O H B A S I T G H
    O T S O T G W D T T A
    O M M A T S O N A W T
    B A M M S H S O S G S

    If we have to see what’s “missing”, maybe I can just add, at the moment, that there are none of these numbers (with possible corresponding letters):

    10 ( J )
    17 ( Q )
    18 ( R )
    21 ( U )
    22 ( V )

  111. DharmaAndWreck Says:

    Ahh, I see. So can you list all the “wrong” words you found as well (like sold)? That might be a place to start…

    Maybe they’re Gardiner codes! H8, S19, O15, S19? Hmm, probably not, as the number just indicates the letter, but I’ll have a look at them anyway.

  112. DharmaAndWreck Says:

    Tried various anagrams of “but sold” as .htm (since they’re the words that stick out), but no luck.

  113. bloggymama Says:

    Ok here’s another idea – I think I’ve figured out why the red numbers don’t tally with the missing words – you need to include ALL the missing words:

    Here’s each line with EVERY WORD included, not just the ones in the table

    T S T S O P A T D O C B (missing letter B)
    T M H B G T A B E S O A (missing letter A)
    F I O A S T N N S O N M (missing letter M)
    N S L A T D W A I W S M T W (missing letters MTW)
    B A O A A T P F B W T S H (missing letters SH)
    H I T M C C B A A H B S O (missing letter SO)
    A T A H W H S M T K H B (missing letter B)
    S P O H B A S I T G H (no missing letter)
    O T S O T G W D T T A S (missing letter S)

    This gives us the missing letters BAMMTWSHSOBSGSD

    Compare this to the red line (BAMMSHSOSGS) and we can see it’s the same apart from four missing letters TWBD or in words THEIR WEAPONS BUT DID or in numbers 20 23 2 4

    So maybe this is ‘what’s missing’?

    Not sure where to go from here though…

  114. bloggymama Says:

    sorry missed the last line – should read

    O M M A T S O N A W T G S D (missing letters GSD)

  115. Spireofdublin Says:

    The first vertical line in raymond’s matrix is the list of red letters from waste

    • bloggymama Says:

      Oh my goodnees you’re right! Well spotted!

      • bloggymama Says:

        Except of course it is because the red letters are the first letter of each word on each row and colomn one = word one!!! If that makes sense!!

  116. walter42 Says:

    nice bloggymama!!! you solved another one!!
    http://the8thspoke.co.cc/buttheirweaponsdid.htm

    • bloggymama Says:

      Yay!!! Was just about to try it as a URL!

      • Sens Says:

        well done :) I took the wrong direction and ignored ALL of the missing words.

      • bloggymama Says:

        You were nearly there Sens!! Good team effort…. :-D

      • sdishman Says:

        Excellent work you guys – I’m trying to get some work done today so I probably won’t be a ton of help, but I’ll try to monitor as best I can and check back after work.

        That being said, at the rate you guys are going, you’ll have the whole thing figured out by lunch. :)

  117. bloggymama Says:

    Oooh interesting!

    This is in the source code – any idea what it means?

    Another code?

  118. bloggymama Says:

    oh didn’t paste it for some reason – I’ll try again

    /4A1D/9A1D/7A/10A6D/1/3A1D/5A/5A1D/3A1D
    L-I.Le-VIII/L-1.Le-VIII/L-II.Le-III

  119. bloggymama Says:

    4A1D maybe means 4 across 1 down? etc.

  120. Spireofdublin Says:

    I tried logging into usenet.com with the username hadesaidoneus27. I clicked on forgot my password and typed my email address. It said it was sent to email address given but i didn’t get anything!

  121. DarrellEW Says:

    L-I.Le-VIII maybe means line 1, letter 8…

  122. oikon7 Says:

    Just an observation: the picture on buttheirweaponsdid.htm is named ‘noir.jpg’. The word ‘noir’ is French for ‘black’. In the matrix screen, we had ‘rouge’, which means ‘red’. There exists a book named ‘Le rouge et le noir’ written by the 19th-century French author Stendhal. Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Red_and_the_Black
    I am not sure if this information might be important.

  123. Spireofdublin Says:

    Thought I had something here.

    I used 4A1D/9A1D . . . etc. on the matrix and got BEAKTHOGH

    Then used LI/LeVIII . . . etc. on the black rock book and got RRU

    Put them together and I got BREAKTHROUGH. No url though! ah well

  124. Spireofdublin Says:

    ha yea thanks brother I didn’t put the .htm at the end lol . Im losin it

  125. env420 Says:

    Man you guys all kicked ass while I was sleeping. Ugh. Good work bloggymama! I’m gonna get to work helping you guys!

  126. bloggymama Says:

    The numbers are:

    [14 24 17 2 1 18 6] [8 1 6 18 18 1] [14 7] [20 26 24 22 25] [16 2 26]

  127. DarrellEW Says:

    subtract 13 (the title of the page) from each number and you get “akdoneus.unseen@gmail.com”… i sent an email to that address as well as “aidoneus”
    “aidoneus.unseen@gmail.com” sent me back an email that said: “Veritas”

  128. DrB Says:

    To add to BM’s post the numbers are laid out like this:

    [14.24.17.2.1.18.8.6].[8.1.6.18.18.1] [14.7] [20.26.14.22.25].[16.2.26]

    i.e. it looks like a paragraph of 1 word, 3 words then 1 word.

  129. DarrellEW Says:

    the subject was also “greco” which lead me to http://the8thspoke.co.cc/aletheia.htm as Aletheia is the greek equivalent of Veritas

  130. DarrellEW Says:

    i guess it’s time to look for some more documents, elliott

  131. Spireofdublin Says:

    I got an email saying Greco Re: Veritas

  132. DrB Says:

    Well, it’s good news for Elliott but not sure where it takes us now.

    Time for another blog post? ;)

  133. DrB Says:

    Good work by the way Darrell :)

  134. lostfan1 Says:

    great job guys! it looks like now wehave to wait and see if elliot has any info on st ignace michigan

  135. env420 Says:

    Man, wtg guys!!! I feel so outta the game right now. What’s our next step?

  136. ElysiumEludes Says:

    Yay! Elloitt’s brother is OK! (for now!)

  137. env420 Says:

    There a place in St. Ignace called the Mystery Spot…interesting yes? :)

  138. env420 Says:

    http://www.mysteryspotstignace.com/

  139. Amanda Says:

    Great job to everyone, I feel like I missed so much! Elliott, I hope you read Aidoneus’ message, we’ve still got a chance to save Nathaniel! Please let us know if you found any new information among your brother’s things (pertaining to St. Ignace, hopefully). To everyone else: Any who e-mailed the 8th spoke, have you received a reply? I’m still waiting..

  140. env420 Says:

    And I am sooooo relieved that Nathan is okay. Hopefully you find some more info in his papers. Good luck Elliott.

  141. bloggymama Says:

    Fantastic job everyone – I KNEW I shouldn’t have gone out just as it was getting interesting :p

    What a day huh!? Go team!

    That mystery spot stuff is VERY freaky! Maybe it will turn out to be one of the places that Nathan was investigating for the location of I.Theta?

    Will try and write a summary on the LostARG blog tonight for all who missed out on the action.

  142. sdishman Says:

    Now that we’re in a momentary down period, I want to suggest something: we may want to consider taking our discussions of these puzzles off of the blog, and to somewhere more suitable, like a discussion forum. UnFiction already has a thread for it at (http://forums.unfiction.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=27856).

    I suggest this for a couple reasons: first, forums are WAY better for collaboration than blog comments. It’s much easier to quote, thread replies, etc. Also, the more activity we bring to that thread, the more likely that other ARG players will notice and join in (seeing as UF is a clearinghouse for all kinds of ARGs).

    Anyways, just my two cents… trying to help streamline our process now, so that if things get even crazier in the future, we’ll be able to solve puzzles more effectively…

    • serm Says:

      Though, it would be nice if the solutions of the puzzles and new clues/websites will be collected as Blog-Comments on this site, if this is possible….

    • ElysiumEludes Says:

      I don’t have a problem with this. The only danger is that we don’t ALL go and then I end up with yet ANOTHER site I need to be checking all day long….Oh well. Let’s give it a go, then.
      We can reserve this space for updating Elliott on any major breakthroughs.

    • Sens Says:

      I’ve posted a few times on unfiction forum. But it seems that some of its users have sort of hostile attitude towards guests. So no more posting there… for me that is.

      • sdishman Says:

        I’m sorry to hear that Sens, especially since I’ve always enjoyed the community feel they have over there – that being said, I haven’t been actively involved in a couple years, so maybe things changed?

        What if we promise to be real nice in the WISH? forum, could we coerce you to come back? You are obviously a puzzle stud so your talents are very valuable. :)

        (META: It also helps the game feel more “immersible” if we take all these comments about the “game” off of an in-game site.)

  143. env420 Says:

    That’s a good idea. I’m in. Signing up now. :)

  144. DharmaAndWreck Says:

    Waah, I go out for groceries and you solve whole thing! Not that I was much use for anything but cheerleading anyway…so GO TEAM WISH!

    I agree with whoever posted it that Noir and Rouge might mean something, just like Light and Darkness. (I’m also very good at saying “This might mean something, someone should look into it.” ;p )

  145. Jay Says:

    You guys do understand that the “Mystery Spot” and all the ones like it are just optical illusions, yeh? there’s nothing myserious at all about any of them, except the terrain. XD

  146. Doc M Daysleeper Says:

    oh no I missed everything while at work!! but OHMIGOD you guyz are AMAZING!!!! A.W.E.S.O.M.E!!!

  147. Riddle Says:

    Great work all of you!

  148. diggingforanswers Says:

    You guys are fast. Great job to everyone. I was at work and missed everything. Upset at myself because it was probably exciting.

  149. bloggymama Says:

    Summary of today’s discoveries now on the LostARG blog!

    http://lostarg.wordpress.com/

  150. MadAriad Says:

    Wow – I missed all the fun!
    I think I’m all caught up on what happened – Great work everyone! I hope I will be able to help from now on (being at my brother’s wedding made it very difficult to participate this weekend!)

  151. DharmaAndWreck Says:

    EMpulse, our image analyzer extraordinaire, noticed that the D in Aidoneus looks different in the last page we got, look:

    http://twitpic.com/5zy0o

    Two indents on the upside, one on the inside below them. No idea yet what it means…But if I’m not mistaken, one of the rabbit holes in “The Beast” was dents in the text of an AI trailer which could somehow be decoded into a phone number. Could this be something similar?

  152. Riddle Says:

    no idea…I´m amazed by this. sorry I can´t help with this one.

  153. thinking... Says:

    did anyone else notice that the black rock disappeared on the 27th…..and there is a space between the A and the I in AIDONEUS

  154. rouge et noir Says:

    rouge et noir(red and black) is a card game i don’t know if that means anything but i thought i’d put it out there

  155. diggingforanswers Says:

    Elliot said on Twitter that something feels off today…could it be because it’s the 27th today?

  156. 0100001010100101111110101 Says:

    I know no secrets, I worship no lies.

    Who am I?

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